Sally: That’s good. So I’m going to go all the way back to before you started making music properly. You you managed a Pizza Spot didn’t you?
JAWNY: I did.
Sally: Because Sarah and I had to kind of unofficially run one to fund art school and to fund BLAG.
JAWNY: Okay. Okay. So you guys know what it was like.
Sally: Oh, I know exactly what it’s like!
JAWNY: I loved it.
Sally: Yeah, I did everything.
JAWNY: I did. Yeah.
Sally: Making the dough to doing the dishes.
JAWNY: Yeah. Same here. Well, we there was a pizzeria in Shrewsbury, New Jersey. I believe they’re still open. Um, I got fired kind of, because they – in a nice way, didn’t have the money to to keep me on. Then, the owner, the boss had to step in and do all the stuff. So he was like, ‘we just, we’re not making enough money now’. Then I heard that they ended up becoming cash flow positive two years later. So that’s a good thing. But I always feel like I’ve thrived in the food industry. Not like McDonalds and stuff like that. That was when I was younger, but one step above that, you know, the fast, casual half restaurant, half fast food experience. I always feel like I thrived in that environment as a manager, as a worker, because it’s just this high pace environment.
Sally: Yeah.
JAWNY: Friday, Saturday, Sunday night kind of feels like a show in a weird way as far as the adrenaline and the the energy and the rush. And you could be yelling at your coworkers and yelling at your chef or whatever it is, and y’all hate each other in the moment. Then after, it’s all like a big family, you could all go get a beer together or whatever. There was something beautiful about that I really liked. And I worked those jobs all the way up until music worked and if music ever fails… I’ll probably do it again because I really liked it. I related to being in the kitchen a lot. It was cool.
Sally: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I had a good time, but I remember that I’d go to college and I’d have a pile of my clothes from the pizza place on the floor and it just would smell, so strong every time!
JAWNY: [Laughs]
Sally: And it’s like, ‘can’t wear that to college!’
JAWNY: Yeah, the smoke, the oils and all that stuff. Yeah.
SOLO > CREATIVE FAM
Sally: Yeah. Big time. And then moving forward, you worked solo on the music for a while and then you transitioned to working with more of a crew. How was that kind of process for you? Because I know that when you make it, when you’re being creative – because I’m from art school, you’ve got a lot of mixed emotions that you’re dealing with when you’re being creative. So you’re excited, you’re vulnerable, you’re kind shy, or… excited or super happy about it. So what was it like when you suddenly had new people around and you’ve got to express yourself in front of them in that way?
JAWNY: Yeah, it’s a really good question too. Originally, yeah, I did get into music just to do it alone, but I think it was more out of necessity than it was… ummm, by choice. And then it became a choice after, right? So say so I became a producer first. I was doing that, doing the producer game thing. But then when I wanted to make music for myself, I obviously didn’t have the money to go into studios, but I already knew how to produce. So it was like, ‘I’ll just do everything myself.’ Then that kind of became a habit after a few years because I’m like, ‘Oh yeah, that’s me. I do everything alone.’ Kind of an unhealthy mindset, right?
Then once I moved to L.A. and, you know, signed to a major label, started actually like getting to the next step of my music career, I think I slowly started cracking the door open a little bit, too. Okay. Well, you know, it takes a village. Like anytime you see someone accept a Grammy, they’re not thanking no one, you know? I mean, like, sometimes there’s people out there that can just like, you know, go to art school. They have skills and abilities that you might not have or strengths and areas that you’re not necessarily strong in, right? So I kind of crack that door open a little bit at the end of 2019, where I was like, ‘all right, I’ve been doing everything myself for like four and a half years now. Let me just try start going in some rooms, becoming vulnerable in front of people, friends and people that I’m comfortable with.’ Right? But while also finding people who were willing to work with me as a producer as well – because I wasn’t going to let go of the producer reins on all my songs, cause I still am a producer on every one of my songs to this day, because that’s where I started. And then slowly but surely from there, I started finding people that I felt comfortable enough to bring into my world and work with consistently, especially with some of the music that I write, because I do get a little sad and vulnerable at times, especially on this new record. So I think it’s super important to have people that you’re comfortable with not only collaboratively, but also just comfortable with on a human level.
Sally: Yeah, exactly.
JAWNY: If you have a concept you’re trying to tackle, you have a sad song you want to do, you want to be in a room with someone you feel comfortable with when you’re up on the microphone or you’re writing or you’re bouncing the idea back and forth. So that was super important to me. But I have found my little friend group crew that I like working with… my pitstop crew. If this is NASCAR, if you will. And it’s been great. And they all respect me as a producer and a writer and they don’t try to change what I got going on because if it’s not broke, don’t fix it. They just try to enhance it. Like if it was a gun, they’re just packing more gunpowder into the bullet, trying to shoot the bullet further. And it’s been great. Dividing and conquering the workload because doing it all alone is really hard. Recording all the stems by yourself is really hard. Every time there’s a note on something, having to do it all yourself is really hard. So it’s cool when you have other people there to utilize as they focus in another area.
Sally: Yeah. How do you feel having other people involved, did it give you more confidence to kind of push yourself more? Were there any areas where you got boosted in a certain way?
JAWNY: Yeah, I think the most important thing is, I figure is probably just a divide and conquer-ness of it because, you know, I’m going to do everything by myself. Originally I’m writing music, I’m producing the music, I’m engineering the music, I’m releasing the music and filming the music video, going to the little meetings. I’m doing all the things. Whenever it gets time to ‘we need to export stuff for this’ or ‘there needs to be a radio edit for for this’ or ‘oh, now we need to clean version of this song’ or now ‘we need a TV mix for this’. So I was having to do all that by myself, while also still making all these things. So it was cool in that regard to have people that can [handle things], you know, ‘Hey yo Mod, do you mind bouncing on a version of the song with X, Y, and Z’ and he can just do it in the background while I’m off doing my own thing. But that seems more too ‘work’ of an answer. But that’s one thing. The second one is more of a human level answer where I don’t know if there’s just some camaraderie there or just some human level thing that you can’t explain. It’s like an intangible thing, but there’s something about a group full of people or just a couple of people that all kind of want to see you win and help you execute your vision to the fullest because they believe in you. That just… it brings out this just natural drive to want to make the best product possible, which is what I’ve been doing now for the last couple of years, where you just feel that I mean, you feel from your label and your managers and stuff, but you feel it in creating music.
Like when I’m in a room alone, I can only trust my own head to be like, ‘Yeah, this is fire’. What if I bring an idea I wrote or a voice memo into a room with people that I trust? Whose taste I trust as well. If they’re… If I’m getting three other confirmations that are like, ‘Oh, yeah, this idea is great. You should run with it.’ That’s now four people, including myself, that I think this idea is great. And I don’t know. There’s something about that too, that’s the extra boost of confidence, I guess, because I can talk myself down off of a lot of ledges oftentimes with my negative thoughts. So that’s great. Yeah, I like it personally. I don’t work with a ton of people, I only work with like three probably tops. I still do a lot of things myself, but it’s been great and I love what we did for this record and it’s amazing.
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Part Two Arriving Soon
